By Tsering Tsomo Chatsug
When I called him up two days back for an 
interview, he was “up” with a bad throat. The indefatigable and fearless activist for Free Tibet just won’t allow anything to get him “down”. By the way, the bad throat was courtesy two protest demonstrations he participated while in London; one in front of the Chinese embassy and the other against GW Travels in Olympia where the agency was selling tours on the Qinghai-Tibet railway. Despite being unwell, he promptly asked me to meet him the very next day for the interview! There have been reports on his activities in London, Scotland and Germany and it was imperative that exile Tibetan media knew more about it.
During his 20-day European tour from June 20 to July 10, he successfully managed to bring the spotlight on the Tibet issue. He was everywhere on the BBC and in major European dailies, speaking plainly and eloquently, devoid of any equivocation and sporting his trademark red bandanna. The always informally attired frail-looking young man had held his own ground against a host of parliamentarians, dignitaries and leaders he met apprising them about the exile situation, Tibetan freedom movement and the Tibet issue. He gave countless talks to young Tibetans in the UK, boosting their morale and making them realise the larger purpose they were born for.
It was an inspiring 30-minute interview with the man who is arguably one of the best youth leaders we have in the Tibetan freedom movement. Meet Tenzin Tsundue, exile Tibetan activist and poet who has redefined the concepts of idealism and activism in the Tibetan freedom movement. If that sounds too exaggerated, then the man has definitely brought back those early exile days of patriotism and the readiness to sacrifice the personal for the larger cause of Tibetan people.
Q: Tell us about your European tour. How did it go?
A: So many things happened this time. This is my first travel to Europe. Many of the meetings I attended were long-pending coordination work that I was to do long time back but couldn’t go. I was able to do that this time. I received these invitations from abroad long time back but didn’t go. As a person who grew up and lives in India and because I have much better understanding of political mechanisms in India, I always thought that i would continue to work here and also because I strongly believe that India supports Tibet freedom movement. It is much more practically effective to be here. Already there’s this huge rush of Tibetans going to foreign countries so they are always there to speak for Tibet in these countries. And why I should also join the rush. So that was the idea in declining many of the invitations in the past. But slowly I found out that if I did go, sometimes as a writer, I am able to say something in my own perspective which may not be the same as many of the Tibetans living there. Also as an activist living in India and having these very strong views for of Tibetan independence. Based on these, many people invited me. Also this time, there was this Student’s for a Free Tibet International Action camp and people who took part in it were more of my kind, you know activists going out in the street and protesting and also campaigning for Tibet. This is how all these things happened.
Q: You said India supports Tibetan freedom movement. What do you think about the recent warming of ties between India and China? You know, the opening of Nathula pass for trade; declaration of 2006 as India-China friendship; exchange of visits between political leaders etc.
A:I don’t see that as any change of scenario in terms of warming of relations between India and China. That’s a very small political exercise to deal with diplomatic relations between two countries. And this is nothing compared to the demands of China. When Wen Jiabao came to India last year, his most important agenda was to create a Free Trade zone between China and India. And India rejected that because India knew that if that happened, India will be flooded with Made in China products which are sold cheap and are of different varieties. But only to maintain the status quo between their relations, India opened the trade route (Nathula) in Sikkim. You will see that India is not at all prepared for mass trade with China because India has no infrastructure to support any mass trade of this kind. So it is only an eyewash. So, I don’t see this as any path breaking relationship between India and China.
Q: But don’t you foresee a time when the increase in trade volumes between the two countries will eventually lead to India arriving at some political concessions vis-a-vis the Tibet issue?
A: No, I don’t see it that way. Indian entrepreneurs always have and wanted to take advantage of improved ties between India and China. These business persons have already set up business centres in Beijing, Shanghai, etc. They are doing wonderful job as businessmen and they are gaining much more. And in trade, India is gaining in business rather than China, while in other countries, it’s the other way round. So, it is the Indian businessmen who are taking advantage of the ties. It’s not about politics. Politically, Indians still have mistrust and suspicion. There’s more mystery around China than realistic understanding of China and Chinese people. So, when there’s no ground for warming of relationship, nothing groundbreaking or pathbreaking can ever be acieved between the two. Basically among the people, there’s so much of mistrust and suspicion. Both live with this cliched image of China being Kungfu masters and the Chinese look at the Indians as people who are dirty and who eat rice and dal with their hands. When I was in Tibet, this is the image that people said to me whether they were Tibetans or Chinese. So, when there’s no understanding between the people, there cannnot be pathbreaking relationship.
Q: You attended the SFT Free tibet Action camp. How was the experience?
A: Overall experience, I felt that the support for Tibet is much bigger than I imagined. I say bigger because I found out from individuals how strongly they felt and how strongly they take part in the freedom struggle. In all the places that I visited: Germany, Scotland, England, people personally get into the freedom struggle which I thought was wonderful. It’s not a cause that is patronised; it’s more than that. People are individually taking part in it. And also because I was able to speak to some of the Members of Parliament.
Q: Were you one of the trainers at the Free Tibet Action camp organised by SFT International in Germany?
A: I was one of the speakers. I spoke there as a writer and an activist living in India. In the action camp, I was able to see many youth activists who are spending their own money to come to the action camp. Their level of participation and the sincerity which with they work, I thought, was wonderful. Most of them were foreigners.
Q: That’s what I find strange because most of these action camps have more foreigners than Tibetans. What could be the reason?
A: Activists whether Tibetans or foreigners, they always think that they need training to do their things effectively. In the west, they always give training a priority. And that was what was happening at SFT action camp. There were Tibetans and they were saying, the level of participation of Tibetans was much higher this time compared to earlier action camps. There were half-Tibetans and Tibetans who were living in India for a long time. I was just happy to see a variety of people who are on-the-ground activists for Tibet campaigning on Tibet from all different countries.
Q: Have you ever considered leading such camps here in India because you have the experience and the talent.
A: We have been having workshops and leadership trainings in India. An action camp on the lines of SFT will be organised this October in India to train youngsters in direct non-violent action. SFT India is going to do it and I will be involved in it.
Q: You were one of the speakers at a panel discussion titled “Alternatives to the Middle Way Approach” in London.
A: What was happening at that time was, yes, it was planned, this panel discussion was planned. But towards the last minute, Mrs. Kesang Y. Takla, the representative of the Dalai Lama at London’s Office of Tibet, she couldn’t come. So it became more of a talk by me and Tenzin Choeying (National Coordinator, SFT-India) together, talking about youth activism and also about picture of activism in India to Tibetan youngsters living in London.
Q: But did you discuss anything on the scheduled topic?
A: It was discussed. I was presenting the scenario of Middle Way approach that calls for genuine autonomy. I was explaining how this ideology came about. How it’s working and its current position and also give my personal view on this. Because I stand very strongly for the indpendence of Tibet. I was also able to show them both the pictures of Middle way looking for an autonomous Tibet and Independence as the goal for the freedom movement. I was able to explain much of these and also discuss and answer questions from the audience.
Q: So were you able to come up with any alternatives to Middle Way at the end of discussion?
A: No, the idea was not more than Middle Way, it was never about that. Over there, there is a confusion about the goal of the freedom movement because there have always been two goals stated and people were not really clear. And the recent Kashag (exile Tibetan cabinet) request for Tibetans not to protest during Hu Jintao’s visit to the US three months back also created lot of confusion not only among Tibetans but more among Tibet supporters. Today Tibet supporters don’t know what to do. Whatever little things they do seem to be going against that request. So, these were certain things that I was able to clarify and also explain in detail what the exile government is thinking.
Q: What was your program in Scotland?
A: In Scotland, it was an 8-hr back-to-back program that happened one afternoon. There were four meetings that happened in a span of 6 hours. First, I met with the president of Scottish PEN, Mrs. Tessa. I raised with her the issue of the Tibetan PEN. You know, the Tibetan PEN writers are called Tibetan PEN Writers Abroad. I told her we didn’t come to foreign countries because we loved to come out of Tibet. We are forced to live in exile. Many Tibetans they continue to come out from Tibet. We were born in India and cannot go back. So, I said it should be exiled Tibetan PEN. and I said we are thinking of raising this issue and changing the name. She wholeheartedly supported this. So, in the next PEN, we would propose to have a change in the name. And we generally shared our views on writers in exile and writers in prison.
Later, I had a talk in a restaurant that is usually frequented by Edinburgh University students and there, there was a small meeting where I explained the situation in exile, how the Tibetans were doing in their freedom struggle, what is the picture, what is the latest issue.
After that, I met Members of Scottish parliament (MSP). They were very supportive of the Tibetan cause. In between, I also visited the Scottish parliament building. I met three MSPs and with them there was also the head of Scottish Amnesty International. While meeting her, I presented her the copy of my testimony that I deposited from England to the Sapnish court (regarding the lawsuit against the Chinese leaders for committing genocide in Tibet). She said she will bring this to the notice of members of Scottish Amnesty International. Also I talked to MSPs and many of them raised their concerns about the railway.
Then in the evening, we had a special meeting in an auditorium with Tibet supporters in Scotland. Much of the members know about Tibet issue and through personal experience as an activist, I was able to share with them the stories of exile and how we continued to have the hope that there will be a free Tibet. So these were four talks and meetings in a span of 6 hours.
Early next morning, I took a flight to Berlin. I was there on July 7. I visited Bundestag (German Parliament). I met a a parliamentarian from the Green party. I also met with Head of east Asia division, Ministry of foreign affairs, Mr. Hans Carl Von Werthern. Both the head and the woman MP seem to have been educated by Chinese coming from China and Tibetans coming from Tibet. They were asking me with their doubts that there seem to be a division between Tibetans inside and outside of Tibet and I clarified that there wasn’t a division. I made it clear that what the Tibetans outside Tibet were campaigning for were the true wishes of Tibet and whatever Tibetans inside Tibet were doing, we supported them. We campaign for them, for the release of Tibetan political prisoners, any information about death, torture, we are the ones who campaign for them. And all the schemes of Chinese development in Tibet which are harming the lives of Tibetans, we speak for them because their voice is suppressedA and this is how we are related. And basically, His Holiness the Dalai Lama being the leader of Tibetans both inside and outside Tibet, we are united by one leader.
In the evening I was asked to address a meeting of Tibet supporters organised by a support group called Tibet Initiative Deutschland. It was raining that day and many people couldn’t come but whatever the attendance, we had a very warm discussion on Tibet. One of the things that was constantly asked by Tibet supporters was the political division among Tibetans on their respective polical stands, that of independence and autonomy. So I explained that this was division on political stands and these shouldn’t be looked at as divisions within the Tibetan community. Political stands can change anytime but it is always the unity of Tibetan people in the movement that really counts. And there we are all united for the benefit of the Tibetan people and the long term goal of Tibetan struggle. We want to create an independent Tibet which is not just politically independent but independent with our education, health system, culture, a truly independent Tibet. That is the long term goal, that is the vision. On July 8, I flew back to London where in the afternoon, there was a celebration of His Holiness’ birthday at the Cathedral hall in Westminster area; it was the biggest gathering of Tibetans and supporters. I was invited as one of the guest speakers. I spoke there as a Tibet campaigner and activist. It was well received. I was never really speaking for political goal of independence. What is the vision of Tibetan movement? It’s about creating an independent Tibetan community where we can live independently in our economy, our political ideology. These are important. If we keep these in mind, present political stand do not really matter. We can have any political stands, we can have Tibetans and Tibet supporters doing everything in support for Tibet. So, political standpoints are minor issues within the larger freedom movement of Tibet. During my 6 days stay in London, I was able to meet various Tibet Support Groups in London.
Q: Tell us about the talk you delivered at Oxford University. How many people attended and what were the common questions that you were asked?
A: The talk at Oxford was a part of a youth training program organized by People and Planet. It’s for youngsters who are into socio-political activism. The camp had 70 participants. I was relating to them how Tibet was a cause of concern for global environment and how it was related to our future due to rampant abuse of nature by China through mining, deforestation and damming the rivers and also by unnatural resettlement of Chinese population in Tibet. They easily got concerned and saw a direct relation to all causes they worked for.
Q: A Tibet Society press release said a representative from the Chinese embassy in London tried to stop the Forum on Tibet program at the British Parliament where you were one of the speakers. What really happened, can you tell us more on this.
A: The Tibet Society can best answer this behind-the-scene story. At the All Party Parliamentary Group for Tibet in UK meeting, the organizers did mention that there was objection from the Chinese side, as usual threatening severing of ties with the UK if they went ahead with this Tibet meeting at the Westminster. It’s a very clear sign that even if a small meeting like this happens in the UK they feel insecure about their foreign relations. It only exposes their insecurity.
Q: You attended a talk given by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday. We heard you asked them a question. What did you ask? Also in the course of her talk, did Jung ever refer to Tibet?
A: This was our first engagement in the UK. In the evening 27th June, we attended the talk by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday, the writers of the now best seller “MAO: The Unknown Story”. Jung Chang became famous after writing Wild Swans. I had read the MAO book, but wanted to meet the writers. After their talk, when the floor was opened for public discussion, I raised the question of China’s invasion of Tibet. Jung said that Mao had always wanted to occupy Tibet, but when his Red Army found the mountains of Tibet too difficult to invade he played the autonomy game. Jung said “the young Dalai Lama got enamoured”. In the meanwhile, Mao made roads into Tibet, and invaded Tibet with military force. By then it was too late for the Tibetans to do anything. Listening to Jung, Mao came out to be this monster who had brilliant mind. The talk was anchored by Elizabeth Hilton, the writer of “In Search of Panchen Lama” and the maker of the BBC film “Kingdom of Lost Boy”. I presented Jung a copy of my book KORA.
Q: Why do you believe that independence should be the goal of the Tibetan Freedom struggle? Some people say it’s not realistic, what will you say to these people?
A: For me, independence of Tibet is not just for political independence. It’s a vision of a New Tibet that is politically, economically, socially independent, and yet maintain a friendly relations with our neighbouring countries. This is not possible if we remain under China. Even today when there are trains running into Tibet, Tibetans in Tibet neither have the education nor the skills to take part in the modern developmental schemes China brings into Tibet. We must understand that what is going on in Tibet is imperialist China’s colonization of Tibet and they will never do anything in benefit of the Tibetans. On the practical ground reality, China is already showing signs of cracking up from within society; big trading partners and corporate giants are constantly reviewing their investment policies in China. We must get ready, so that when change does come to China, we do not miss our bus. Genuine autonomy is only a wishful thinking.
Q: Three activists for Free Tibet unfurled a banner at Beijing Central railway station on the eve of July 1 launch of China’s railway to Tibet. You were one of the firsts among exile Tibetans in India to carry out such acts in India. Ever thought about doing that it in China?
A: Yes, the first battleground for the independence of Tibet should be Tibet itself. We are in exile, and therefore most of our activities are symbolic in nature. In such an attempt I went to Tibet nine years ago in March 1997. But, the plans didn’t work out. I was too naive and inexperienced. Now to do anything in China would be too costly in many ways. We can work with our people inside Tibet. If needed in our plans we will do things in the heart of China. I believe Tibetan youngsters now have the education and skills to do anything.
Q: What is the status of the recent sworn testimony that you filed in London against genocide crimes committed by Chinese leaders in Tibet? What will it achieve for the Tibetan cause?
A: The deposition that I filed from the UK was my testimony as a witness of torture and ill treatment of Tibetan political prisoners in Tibet. It’s largely based on my 1997 trip to Tibet where I got arrested by Chinese police and had to spend three months in prison, during which I saw inhuman treatment of Tibetans in prison. Since I was coming from India, we were not sure that I could file my deposition from there, but we got the certificate quite easily from the Foreign and Commonwealth Office of Ministry of Foreign Affairs, UK. The testimony will be used in the lawsuit against Chinese leaders for genocide in Tibet in the Spanish National Court.
Q: Your last book was KORA. Any plans for more books; things that are still in the making?
A: I haven’t been able to write much poetry for quite sometime, but I have been regularly writing essays. I am making a compilation of all my essays into a book soon. But that requires some money and time. In the meantime, I live out of selling KORA.
Tsering Tsomo Chatsug can be reached at editor@phayul.com
