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It's evening in Shigatse and the lights are coming on. In the Chinese district of the Tibetan mountain town, strings of fairy lights flicker around rows of shopfronts where women perch waiting for customers and men stumble out from backroom corridors....
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17 comment(s) found You are on page 1 of 2
Lhalung peldor  

Location: lhonub sinpoiyul
Subject: The anti-Lama and anti-monk bandwagon
Aug 24 2005 06:13 AM

I was amazed at the callous remarks made by the person who calls himself "Drenthor" from Kathmandu and his bandwagon of bleeding hearts. You think you are sooooo smart that you do not see the need for big monasteries and golden statues eh? So you are so westernized and progressive that these things are infact unnecessary, do you? For your information, we Buddhists believe in life after death. This life is not the end of life but we are said to be reborn. We therefore believe that we need to prepare for the next life and to do that, we need to create merit. Building monasteries, stupas and Buddhas is part of the Buddhist practise to achieve a higher rebirth in the immediate future and ultimately the state of Buddhahood. You guys are actually trying to prove yourselves more knowledgible and see there is no need for such things. It only goes to prove your ignorance about the whole Buddhist concept of generosity. You might say, but why not hospitals and schools? Well, they are indeed very good but a monastery helps those to achieve permanent happiness by achieving nirvana or Buddhahood while schools and hospitals help the beings only on temporary basis and because of the benefit which is accrued by the beings, the merit gained out of building monasteries and hospitals differ in weight. To built a monastery and Buddha statue is therefore much more meritorious than schools and hospitals. It is for this reason many of them are built by individuals or groups as a means of purifying their bad karmas and also create merit for the future lives to come. Look at the stupa of Boudanath and Swaymbunath, the famous Mahabodhi stupa in Bodh Gaya or the Dhamek stupa in Banaras, they have served as inspiration and object of devotion for millions of pilgrims across the world for centuries. May I ask you where are the hospitals and the schools built during the times of Ashoka or Harsha Vardhana or the Kushan kings? What have they done for humanity through the ages? Do you see it "Drenthor"? Indeed you have called yourself exactly what you are!! "Drenthor" in Tibetan means the "one who lost his memory". That's exactly what you are!!!
The other aspect is building these large monasteries is another way of projecting our Buddhist culture to the world. If you have visited Lumbini which is the birth place of Lord Buddha, the Chinese have built a huge monastery even though we know they have destroyed our ancient monasteries by the thousands. Why do they do that? Are they crazy? No. They want to project the presence of the Chinese to the world. The Japanese, the Thais and Burmese have also built their monasteries in Bodh Gaya. There are very few monks who live in them. Like wise, you might have heard of China towns across the globe, why do they have them? They are a means of projecting Chinese culture to the world. Likewise, we have the Kentucky Fried Chicken, the MacDonalds and Redrooster, projecting American culture to the world. When people visit these places they come across the cultures of these countries either in food, religion or art. The monasteries built by our ancestors across central Asia such Mongolia, China and Afghanistan bear a permanent symbolic presence of our Tibetan culture. So, open your eyes to the wider importance than a narrow outlook which only goes to show your bias and petty intolerance.
The whole bandwagon of guys who calls themselves such names as "Dador", "Tenzin" "boe-gyalo" the Chinese dog who delibrately offends the Tibetan people by using our HH's name, last but not least "Drenthor", I fully respect your right to say but I reject vehemently your assertions which are based not on authority but jealousy, intolerance and ignorance. The things you are saying is nothing new. The Chinese communists have used such pretext to demolish our great monasteries and kill the monks and nuns or sent them to concentration camps. Today, you have discarted your own heritage and culture and are fast embracing the culture of the west which are often touted as progressive and you sincerely believe this to be true and ape the west like monkies and even have the temerity to critize your own ancestral culture as "backward" as this guy who calls himself ""Dador" from San Francisco says and I quote "failure by by Rinpoches and Trulku, one simple fact is that we are still living backward". You know, this is the sort of pretext the Chinese communists used to destroy our culture and today we have ONE OF US MOUTHING the same CRAP to denigrate our own culture!! This only goes to show the the terrible danger Tibetans are facing with the survival of our culture and religion because it is now not only the Chinese communists but even the younger generation of Tibetans who have no inkling of their culture show disdain and even dislike of the most sacred things we Tibetans have held for ages. Your crtisism of Trulkus and monks raising fund in the west looks like a healthy criticism which is welcome but then you do not know why this being done. Since 1979, when Deng Xioping opened Tibet and Tibetans could travel to and fro from their homes in exile, the exile-Government has estimated that some 9-10 thousand monks and nuns have escaped across the Himalayas to study in India and Nepal. They are given some money by the Exile-Government for the food but where are they to be accomodted? Owing to Chinese restrictions and poor quality of Buddhist education inside Tibet, a flood of monks and nuns continued to pour from Tibet through these many years since 1979.All of them need to be looked after and nobody can be turned back by our people.They need to be looked after for they medical expenses, clothing, beds and everything from spoons to chappals to tooth-brush to tooth-paste. Who is going to pay all these expenses, may I ask the bandwagon? Where is the money coming from? For your information, the young boys and girls who join the monastery are not the likes of you who are rich and spoiled, but from very poor families. All the rich Tibetans send their children to English medieum schools and some of them abroad to the USA, to the UK and other western countries. "Drenthor" would never conceive of his children ever being send to the monastery. If he has they might probably be in Kalimpong or Darjeeling. It is the children of poor families in Tibet or India who join the monsteries.The expenses for medicine and clothing etc are recurring expenses and therefore needs continued support. Today there are hardly anybody wanting to become monks or nuns from the Exile community!!!!!! All of them are much the same like the bandwagon who more or less despise the very notion of joining the sangha community or atleast loath them. The only ones are those who are coming from far off Tibet. The Gracious Buddha said that without the practise of Vinaya vows, there is no Buddhism. The people who bear the torch of Buddhism therefore is the sangha or the monk and nun community. This is the Buddha's words not mine. The monks and nuns ARE THE PEOPLE WHO TAKE THE VINAYA VOWS AND KEEP THEM. If there are no such people, it is as good as there is no practise of Buddhism because Buddhist practises mainly hinges on the THREE HIGHER TRAININGS,( Tib:labwa sum, moral ethics, single pointed concentration and wisdom). Without these as the basis no practise will have any meaningful realization. So if you like Buddhism you have to like the monks and nuns as well, as the Tibetan saying goes "ke dodna, baa dodgoe which means if you like the neck you must also like the goitre. Ever since Tibet lost it's independence, the monk and nun's community have preserved what was left of our religion and now instead of having a sense of gratitude, these numbskulls are discrediting the monks and nuns by demonizing them and painting them like the prostitutes in Lhasa. I say to "Drenthor", if you are a Tibetan, who is actually having the biggest laugh for the things you have said about the monks of Sera? It is your friends in Beijing. They have even made a monument to denigrate the monks in Lhasa which apparently had been removed these days because of the locals sensetivity. Even the Chinese have more sensetivity than you. In this monument which was displayed in one of the museums in Lhasa, there is this awful looking monk, menacingly looking and holding the hand of the child in an act of taking it away and the mother wailing behind the child with her stretched hands in an attempt to get a grip of her child which is being forcibly taken by the monk. The message is obvious. It depicts the monks forcibly removing little kids from their mothers for their sexual gratification. You have said as much and if you are a Tibetan you should hang your head in shame for bringing disgrace to the entire Sangha community. It is true that some deviant monks do indulge in such things but this is not to say that the whole monk community of Sera does such things. You have no prove of such things except the unfortunate incident of two young monks, which was sensationlised by no other than the founder of the first Tibetan communist Party, the late K. Dhondup. The motive behind such sensationlism is no doubt to bring disrepute to the monk community in their attempt demonize Tibetan Buddhism. In every society there are bad apples. Can you tell me which society is free of vice?? IN YOUR OWN CASE, HAVE YOU NEVER CHEATED YOUR WIFE? WHY DO YOU DO SOMETHING WHICH YOU KNOW IS WRONG? YOU DO IT BECAUSE YOUR DESIRE GETS THE BETTER OF YOU AND YOU HAVE NO CONTROL. NOW, THOSE MONKS WHO DO SUCH THINGS ARE ALSO IN THE SAME BOAT AS YOURSELF, WHERE YOU CANNOT CONTROL YOUR LUST SOMETIMES. The likes of you guys who live in your tower of ignorance and arrogance, I say to you, just as you have the right not to be a monk, the monks and nuns also have right to be what they are. If you do not like the big monasteries, do not go to them, keep away from them. If you do not like the golden Buddhas, do not go to pray infront of them, Boycott them. If do not like the monks and nuns, do not call them when somebody dies from your family. It is your right. We all have choedad rangmoe (religious). But please, please, just because you hate them, do not accuse and denigrate the whole community for the mistakes of the few. DO NOT PAINT THE WHOLE COMMUNITY WITH ONE BRUSH.THIS IS TOTALLY UNFAIR AND UNBECOMING OF A TIBETAN.

Location: va
Subject: wake up
Aug 21 2005 11:41 AM

we gotta fight this shii na mean... we tibs need to wake up and see the fire burnin rite in front of us. our brothers n sisters suffering n dying back in our home land...... no more non violence action gotta gotta b our onli option ... by force... eye for eye blood fo blood....

Location: USA
Subject: Chinese colonialismq
Aug 18 2005 10:46 PM

This is an example of what Chinese colonialism has done to Tibet. China claims its past 50 year rule of Tibet has been beneficial to Tibetans.

However, the reality is quite opposite. Tibetans are extremely poor. The majority make less than US$1 per day. Tibetans are the poorest ethnic group in any area controlled by China. Even Chinese living in Tibet are far richer than Tibetans in Tibet. This is evidence of colonialism & racial discrimination against Tibetans.

Chinese rule in Tibet has brought Tibetan women to this position where they have few opportunities in life & little education.

Location: San Francisco
Subject: The Issue is Also What Change Must Be Brought In.
Aug 18 2005 10:22 PM

Whether are impacts of Chinese entry into our land or failure by Rinpoches and trulku, one simple fact is that we are still living backward.
When such issue is brought up on the news, we will get moved and feel something concrete must be done, which is extremely good. But, whether Tibet is with us or not at the moment, what really counts is whether we have developed ourself as a people with the changing world. We need more educated, skilled people to compete with the Chinese, that is the need of the hr.

Location: usa
Subject: my respond to tsabo
Aug 18 2005 08:25 PM

I didn’t say all monks but don’t you agree with many of them are trouble some look at the dharamasala incident when the director and students of Buddhist dialects were killed by monks form shugden group but the media people doesn’t particularly named individual group as it mentioned Tibetan monk. We didn’t mean to say Tibetan monks are bad but what I am trying to say is they need to follow the path of teaching Buddha and that is to help suffering people. I know they do blessing and they even took responsibility of TIPA to perform some dances at the stages. Great! I think they should get some examples from the Buddhist monk from thai, burma,combodiahow to live as true monk. I have seen those monk and their vows…its amazing!

Location: India
Subject: Try to be unbiased
Aug 18 2005 04:39 PM

When Tenzin and others are saying - rather aggressively - that Tibetan monks are touring all over the world, chanting and dancing, and this probably means that Tibetan Buddhism is dying, I have a big question to ask. DID YOU EVER THINK THAT THESE CHANTING MONKS ARE REALLY HELPING PEOPLE? Why you all talking about money only? Please leave the money issue alone. Look at all these thousands of people who get blessed by the monks and nuns who come to their countries. Not everyone in this world can afford going to Dharamsala or South India to get in touch with Tibetan Buddhism. The meeting with the travelling monks is their only chance to come accross with the Buddha's teaching. Buddha was also traveling, aftrewards.

Thy to have a wider perspective, don't think about Tibetan people only, try to think about HUMAN BEINGS who suffering everywhere and even in the USA, as strange as this may seem to some of you.

But if you are so attached to the Tibetan people only, and if you think that monks MUST solve the money problems for the lay society, please visit: www.tibetanlivingcommunities.org
Some monks do think about village people's welfare. Try to be unbiased.

Location: Modern-World
Subject: "High thinking but Simple living"
Aug 18 2005 03:43 PM

Do we really need all these pompoise monasteries and many monks in this modern age.At the time of Buddha,everything was simple but of higher standard in wisdom and practise.
The real essence of buddhist philosophy is now under great threat of vanishing from the whole picture of true buddhism. Instead the "Materialistic Buddhism" is gradually taking over as a threatening trend among the practioners.
Why do we still spend so much money and resources for the 100 years for glorifying monasteries,labrangs and altars? Do we really need these accesories to get faster to nirvana? I don`t think so.Lesser one has,faster and better one reaches the highest "Path or Ground".
Instead we must spend all our resources for social and educational works.This is the basic fundamental work to prevent the social degradations as we are seeing now in Tibet nad India among tibetans.
ari bhu  

Location: usa
Subject: pros
Aug 18 2005 09:22 AM

dear friends this is my mantra..'prostitution by our tibs gals or uneducated tibetans or unskilled tibs ..all this sums up into chinese invasion of tibet...so do something by 2008...dont forget olympics in china...something big..something really big
DaLaid Lama  

Location: Shangrila
Subject: I knew it!
Aug 18 2005 08:45 AM

DaLaid Lama isn't alone, there are many.

Location: Kathmandu
Subject: Rinpoches and gold and prostitutes
Aug 18 2005 05:34 AM

This is true that our Rinpoches are eagerly raising funds to build biggger monasteries with golden Buddhas but with few monks. Even the monks are in robe by the day and found in the brothels by night. They are emulating Tsangyang Gyatso, the 6th dalai Lama.

There is something fundamentally wrong in Tibetan Budhdist system where they have tulkus and rinpoches who are spoiled rich kids who abuses the money of the dead and the devotees.Khyentse Norbu is an example making films and womanising around the world while enjoying the title of the great Khyentse Tulkus. Who is recognising these fools as tulkus? How many tulkus recognised by some highest lamas in the system are not keeping teir vws but abusing money and welath of the previous lama. If some of the money were spent on building schools and women's education that will be good. What si the religious dept in D-sala doing about this? They issue letter of recommendation to every little group for raising funds for this and for that. Look at the monks from Sera, Drepung Gaden and anunnery from Kopan all who have become performers and artists. They publicly display mandalas and Tibetan nuns and monks come to dance in world theatres. All to raise money ofcourse. How is the increassing number of monk and nuns performing from Gelukpa moansteries in Nepal and India going to keep the profile of Tsongkhapa's purity of vows and practice.

I thought Gelukpas were the reformists and pure ones but now a days they are running around the world as gypsies.First they come as chanting monks and then they are dancing monks and then they are buying house monks, then they have become landlord monks.Their western nuns have become marriage celebrants, it is absurd that nuns become marriage celebrants.So this 21 century Buddhism in action, of course there are many that are good too. I can see why China is trying to highlight the quality monks rather than building huge numbers like an army.We need good and few monks, but they like numbers don't they, sera 5,500, Drepung 7,700 and so on.Of these how many young good looking boys are sex workers called 'dron-po' (guest) for older geshes and some of the rinpoches too? So do not blame the Chinese or poverty for the sex workers in Shigatse, tibet had them all along within the monastic compounds. Go to Sera in South India, you will see happening. It s importnat to see one's own faults before one point finger to the other. The Chinese have brought many things to Tibet. List the all honestly. Tibet has many old mistakes and list them too.Prostitutes are fact of life as is guest in the monasteries.Wake up!
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